* Intro + Start Music
Sonja:
Today we're going to talk to Claude. It's the women on the road time. Oh Claude, I was so touched by our pre-talk and so touched by this story that you were sharing. And with an open heart, can you share this life story with us to understand how you came to yoga?
Claude:
Sure. My mother left me when I was a newborn. I was three or four weeks old. I was born in the maternal grandparents' house in the south of France. But she was only 21. She had a teaching job in Morocco. So she left me. And my maternal grandparents couldn't take care of me at the time. They were gardeners and it was the south of France, the full season. So they drove me to the paternal grandparents where I was left there. And I must have felt abandoned because I cried. I was told I cried all the time. Six weeks later, the garden was more quiet. The maternal grandparents drove to the paternal grandparents and brought me there. But I continued crying and crying and crying. And then six weeks later at Christmas, so I was born in August and at Christmas, my parents came back from Morocco and they had found a place, a house and a room, and they could welcome the baby finally. And they went and they said they didn't recognize me. I probably didn't recognize them either. I don't know. I was only five months. They brought me to Morocco by plane through there. And she went back teaching the next day, leaving me in the loving hands of a Moroccan nanny. I'm sure she was loving, but I cried and I cried and I cried. You understand why? Six weeks, six weeks, six weeks, the hot potato feeling. Where do you belong? Who wants that? Who wants that? That's what I was explaining.
When I was working my first job, I was working for a French bank in Germany, mergers and acquisitions. Really, really hard, really tough. And I had a burnout after three years of it. Three years just and you were young. I was, yeah, I was young. Got my MBA from, yeah, in the US. I was only age 21 as well, which is like my mom. And then I started working for this French bank. Yeah, I was probably 25 or 26 when it happened. I was young. With Burnout ended up in the hospital and on antibiotics. And when I came back two months later, finally got a sign-off from the doctors and I could finally walk again. I arrived at the bank. Someone was sitting on my desk. And when I was told I had been replaced in my absence, you know, this hot potato feeling, who was I didn't belong to anywhere, resurfaced. And I felt completely gutted. Even if the bank was quite nice and said, "Oh, we're not throwing you away. You're not abandoned. We thought you would be better in that position, which is more quiet and credit for me." Nevertheless, he was a failure, and I felt rejected. So it was tough. And I did a cycle in Germany at the time, and all these resurfaced. And then I met my lovely husband, and he's British. So we moved to the UK, and there I worked for an American investment bank. Another madness. Crazy, crazy, crazy, crazy. And one day I was feeling a lot of tension everywhere. And the physio said, "You know, you need to start moving. If you're like that at age 30, imagine how you'll be at age 50 or 60? Why don't you start yoga?" Because they were offering yoga classes for employees. So that's when I started. And I never looked back, never, never looked back. But when this investment bank again, it didn't work out, no, the burnout and well, it was too tough for me after a couple of years. And they told me it was not working. So I had to go.
So I went to Kathmandu, working around the Anakrona, and I ended up in the Copan monastery outside Kathmandu for yoga and meditation. And that's the first time in my life where I realized I was home. I said, "I have arrived. I'm home. I know what I want to do. I know where I belong." The first time ever where I didn't feel rejected, I felt accepted as I was.
Sonja:
How old were you?
Claude:
Perfection with everything. Just accepted. I belonged there. I was by then 32, and I didn't want to go back to the UK. When my husband came to visit me a few weeks, I said, "Oh, I'm going to become a Buddhist and live in monastery, and I'm not going back to the UK anyway." He was patient, and ultimately I came back, and we had children.
The first one, fine, lovely boy, still working in finance, still handling everything, mothers and career. And then my second one, 20 months later, unfortunately, I had a lot of health issues, very severe issues, born with no heart defect. So unfortunately, I spent 18 months in the hospital and in the most critical state. Dr. Stolders was over for 13 times, 13 times. It was terrible. We had to say goodbye to her 13 times. They said she was sedated. It was a real roller coaster. And, you know, I didn't think about the other one; this one was healthy. I stayed with the baby because each day was dramatic. Each day they told me it was the last day. I didn't know what to do. So I was expressing milk for the baby who couldn't drink anything. It was just tube-fed. And I was staying in the hospital. So the oldest one was only 20 months. He was put in a lovely, loving, Montessori nursery, but it's not mom. And then an au pair who used to pick it up in the evening. She was probably very calm, very nice, but it's not mom. But I didn't realize I repeated that pattern. Never realized until now, now he's 25. And he told me, "You know, I'm leaving. I'm going to Australia to work." And I said, "Why so far?" And he said, "You know, ma'am, I need to find myself." And suddenly I understood everything. I realized, "Oh my God, it's been a full circle, this pattern, you know, feeling that you don't really belong somewhere. Feeling you are abandoned, feeling you're rejected, feeling you're not good enough." And for me, yoga really helped me. And that's why ultimately I became a yoga teacher. But my son is young, and he needs to find his path.
Sonja:
There were all those challenges. And I love how you said this thing about the monastery. So when you came back, and when you still had those challenges with the kids, where were the pivotal moments of yoga?
Claude:
Of course. So I started doing yoga more rigorously as soon as I came back from Nepal. So I was in between, I had the first one maternity leave and the second one. And I realized each time I was in a yoga class that I felt at home. And this feeling of "I know where I come from. I know where I am in the present moment in yoga, and I know where I'm going." You know, it's like we circle belong the universe. Yoga means union, union of the body and the mind, the movement, the asana, the right movement of oneself with the universe. And this feeling of union, this state of union is the time in my life where I'm at peace. I don't have this feeling of "Where do I belong? I've been rejected. I'm not good enough." I am there. And really, really, Sonia, that's probably why I ended up, I'll tell you later, as a yoga teacher, it's really this feeling I am at home. And I would like everyone, everyone to experience that one day. Because it's the most beautiful feeling. Do you know where who you are? Oh, you have gained self-confidence.
Sonja:
Where does it come from, Claude? Where do you feel it comes from?
Claude:
Well, it feels, first of all, it comes from a deep connection with your body. You know, as a young child and as a young person before I discovered yoga, I felt like a snail always carrying my home on my little snail, you know, and you carry everything because you don't belong anywhere. Move from place to place. And it continues in my life. I wanted to spare you the detail. But all my life, you know, it was there and then Rocco and then boarding school for 16 years more and then I'm boarding school. I left my parents, and I felt rejected again. It was not their fault. There was no school where they left where they left. But it's just how I felt. And then I ended up in France, and I didn't know France. I was 16. So I left and I did an MBA at the end of the US, the bottom, deep bottom, south bottom of the US. And then I did it in Germany without speaking a word of German, stayed for eight years, and then married a Brit in England for 25 years. So all my life I felt I don't really quite belong there. Only in yoga that I am at home. And now that I found this connection with my own body, connection with self-confidence, I can go anywhere and I'll feel at peace, at ease, because the disease opposite of ease, disease means unease. You are not well because you're not at ease. In yoga, I'm at ease, at peace, you know. The body in the mind, the body stretches, the body feels wonderful, and the mind is relaxed. Do you know the book of Ericha Steifman saying moving in stillness? You know, it's like moving in silence, moving in stillness. And I love this. And also I used to say my body is my temple, the asanas are my prayers and it's a deep connection with the universe.
Sonja:
That's beautiful. It sounds like you know from those stories that many of us know that running away, and I can, I'm a testament to that. I have been trying to run away to places, and I remember once the situation when I was in Barcelona, I was like 18 years or 19. I was there with my backpack. I was alone in the streets. It was raining, you know, there's a specific smell in Barcelona. And I was walking there and seeing those big houses. And it just felt like being a traveler of life all the time. So I also can so much relate to this running away and being out and trying to break away from something, and we never know where we're going to and how you describe it so beautifully. We are going into ourselves, into this present moment of magic where everything makes sense suddenly, right?
Claude:
That's exactly, exactly. And each time, as I described, each time I had a feeling of rejection in my life, which happens probably to everyone. You know, you're not succeeding in everything you do. I'm the science in all the relations I wish, but you know, all the relationship, you know, the careers in all the job with all the friendship, there are moments in life where something doesn't work out for everyone. And in my case, I really felt like it was the end of the world. I felt so rejected that I felt so abandoned. I couldn't cope. And it's only in the yoga and the meditation classes or now in my own practice that I can go on.
Sonja:
Yeah, I think it's such an incredible journey and how you described it. You actually were longer in the career than me. I think I made 20 years. How much did you do?
Claude:
33. 10 years in banking in Germany and in the UK and then 23 years at American financial firm S&P, Standard and Poor's Rating Services, as well in finance. So yeah, 33 years. So it took me a long time before I realized I needed to change career. And I wish people realized that earlier. But children by then, one of them had a huge problem. My daughter in the middle, now she's with us, she lives, she's fine, she's 23, but she still has a lot of medical issues and we need to accompany her and I need to be there for her. And when I decided to become a yoga teacher age 55, was still a leap of faith because I was thinking, can I do it? I'm too old. Can I do this? I'm totally inflexible. I can't touch my toes. I've been at a desk for 33 years in my life. I did some yoga, of course, but like once or twice a week, nothing serious. Is it not crazy to believe you become a yoga teacher? And now I'm 60. Look at me. I'm teaching 10 to 12 classes a week. I did my business plan. The first year was to start teaching. The second year to have a presence online and a website. The third year to host my first yoga retreat. Now I'm hosting even two. Even better plan hosted one in the summer for the summer solstice. Another one for auto mechanisms and it grows and grows and grows because I try to share this passion of yoga. Asana, of course, feeling better stretch, but also the stillness, being in the present moment, being connected, you know, meditation, pranayama, the philosophy of yoga. It's not just the asana. It's a whole whole packet. Yes, of course I do charge for classes, but the most important for me is nevertheless that the people I teach feel better. That's my only main goal. My goal is I want them really, really want them to feel better. I want them, I want to create a home for them in the, within their body. I want them to connect with themselves. I want them to be proud of themselves. Do you know, I want all these women, I teach a few men, but it's mainly women. I want all these women to feel proud of themselves, self-continent, reconnected with their body, all in their men opposite, all the issues we are. No, I want them to be proud, strong, happy, happy. I want them to, yes, to become a good man. And if I could create a home inside of their own body, that's what I would, that's what I aim to do. That's what I try to do. I want them to feel they can overcome all their challenges. I've got younger ones who have challenges with their children and burnout. I've got elder ones who have challenges with their body and injuries, and I want all of them to feel good, better.
Sonja:
You are right... I mean, you told me a little bit about what this, muscly man said to you after he's been to your class, even though you usually teach women, but...
Claude:
Yeah, no, I have a few men, of course, in some of the classes, and he was doing so much bodybuilding. You could see all the muscles, so, so big. And he said, "Oh, I can't, I can't, I can't, I can't sit in meditation. No way you could sit cross-legged." So I put all this block and all this cushion, he was sitting on the little mountain of stuff. And at the end, you know, when he left the class, and I said, "Are you all right?" You said, "I've never felt so good, so good in my whole life." And I looked at him and smiled, and I said, "This is yoga, you know, for you."
Sonja:
There's this funny story that my yoga teacher told me once. A guy living on Ibiza-shaped head, amazing, amazing human being. And he said, "Look, men's health, everybody's looking at men's health magazines, and they're looking at those muscles, you know, and the six pack, and you know what? It doesn't matter. It's wrong. It's wrong." And then all those people were sitting there, first lesson, not really getting it. After three days, they were all like, you could see it in the eyes suddenly, like the shift. It does happen. Yeah, maybe the home that you're talking about is the home that you're creating for them to find themselves, you know?
Claude:
I'm not there to demonstrate that I can stand on my head, and I can do this, and I can do that, which I learned over the years, because yoga teacher, but it's not the goal. The goal is for them to feel better, and I'm really holding the space for them, and to help them create a home, and connect with that home inside their body, inside their, its body, mind, spirit, it goes together.
Sonja:
It's almost like when you are working with those people, and then you said, "Of course, I ask for money," because it's always this issue of asking for money, and you've built this business. So what are your aspirations? How do you see you in this business now, and where do you want to go? What are your dreams, visions, ideas?
Claude:
Well, I'm a lucky, lucky place where currently I don't even have to do much marketing for my classes. My actual student keeps recommending me to others, and others, and others. It's fantastic. I almost have to say no. So this is the best place for when people recommend you, and you don't have to work hard or try hard. That's the first time in my life where I don't have to try. It just happens. You have to believe and try that it's coming. So now, for instance, I'm living for Australia and India for a yoga and alveoli retreat in India, in Australia, my son, and I just find a replacement. I don't want to leave my students on their own. But who would have thought when I started at my teacher training age 55 that at age 60 I would have so many students that I could find a replacement. I mean, it's a great place to be. So I don't want to be too ambitious, but if I dare tell you what my dream is, my dream would be to bring my lineage, which is called ISHTA, to France. ISHTA means Integrated Science of HATA. It's a classic HATA. Tantra, Tantric philosophy, and Ayurveda. I mean, it was created in South Africa in the US by Alan Finger, and he has trained 100,000 of teachers over the years. He's still well and alive, living in Florida, but he's trained and teaches ISHTA center only in the UK, in Sweden, and in Germany, in Berlin. So London, Stockholm, there. And I say, what about France? Paris is the obvious place. Now I move from the UK, living in France, and I'd love to become the ambassador and create this with them, of course, with all their teachers, to create here ISHTA yoga training. But of course, it's very, very ambitious because I'm still a new yoga teacher. So we'll see if I can develop this dream and make it happen. But it's good to have a dream. Whatever I age, I say to women, don't stop dreaming, because the day you stop dreaming, probably die. It's good to always aspire for more.
Sonja: Oh, Claude, what a wonderful conversation. So for finishing it off, I would like to ask you the final question. What would you like to, as a one sentence, one insight, one thing for our audience to remember from this conversation?
Claude: Well, I've got two, quick. First one is, it's never too old to start. Was it yoga or anything else? Never too old to start. That's my own lesson. Never too old. Believe in yourself. You can do it. And the second thing is, do take yourself. You are your best friend. You, each human being, take time in the day, every day. It could be five minutes, ten, or an hour, for you. Start small and grow. So if they can start a little practice, very gentle yoga, they can see my videos if they want on Instagram or YouTube, or they can call me, they can call the best yoga friend or teacher next door, you know, everyone has someone in their community teaching yoga. They can take, learn the basic and then do it a bit at home. Take some time or take a bus, then walk to the yoga, put a candle, take time for yourself. You are your best friend and never stop dreaming. Yeah, eventually doing a little bit every day is better than nothing at all. Exactly. And it could be just five minutes. Wake up every morning with a gratitude practice, smile all the time and think what will happen. That's what I'm trying to tell them.
Sonja: This is beautiful. Beautiful last words, Claude. Thank you so much for this.
And let's together - Grow Happy like a Rich Hippie.
Claude: Thank you. Thank you so much
Sonja: Namaste.
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